242. Memorandum of Conversation1
SUBJECT
- President’s Meeting with Prime Minister Begin
PARTICIPANTS
- President Jimmy Carter
- Honorable Warren Christopher, Deputy Secretary of State
- Dr. Zbigniew Brzezinski, Assistant to the President for National Security Affairs
- Honorable Samuel Lewis, U.S. Ambassador to Israel
- Honorable Alfred L. Atherton, Jr., Ambassador-At-Large
- Honorable Harold Saunders, Assistant Secretary of State (North East & South Asian Affairs)
- Robert Lipshutz, Counsel to the President
- Hamilton Jordan, Assistant to the President
- William B. Quandt, National Security Council Staff
- Jerrold Schecter, National Security Council Staff
- H.E. Menahem Begin, Prime Minister
- H.E. Simcha Dinitz, Israeli Ambassador to U.S.
- H.E. Hanan Bar-On, Minister, Israeli Embassy, Washington
- H.E. Aharon Barak, Attorney General of Israel
- Mr. Yehiel Kadishai, Director, Prime Minister’s Office
- Mr. Joseph Ciechanover, Minister for Economic Affairs, Israeli Embassy, Washington
- Gen. Ephraim Poran, Military Secretary to the Prime Minister
- Mr. Dan Pattir, Public Affairs Adviser to the Prime Minister
- Dr. Eytan Bentsur, Counselor, Israeli Embassy, Washington
- Mr. Yehuda Avner, Adviser to the Prime Minister
- Dr. Marvin Gottesman, Private Physician to the Prime Minister
The President: I want to extend my personal welcome to you and your colleagues. This is the anniversary of a great event.2 The American people will be very receptive to what you have to say about Israel. We had good talks with Foreign Minister Dayan,3 and I have noticed that all of our news programs on Sunday4 concentrated on the Middle East. This shows how important peace in the Middle East is to the American [Page 1130] people. In my remarks later today, I will reconfirm our friendship for Israel, and our commitment to her security and peace for Israel.5
The last time we met6 we had frank and fruitful discussions which I believe helped in the search for peace in the Middle East. We had a clear delineation of differences on some matters of opinion. Since then I have had several communications from President Sadat, and Minister Weizman has been to Egypt. Perhaps you could outline some of the recent developments.
Prime Minister Begin: I was gratified to learn today that the Egyptians will be submitting counterproposals to us in the near future. We have a plan for peace which can serve as the basis for negotiations, as you yourself have said.
We have asked for counterproposals. I suggest that we ask the Egyptians to form a committee with us to study both our proposals. Perhaps we will have a positive reply. It is worth asking Sadat. This is good news to us.
Questions have been raised about the review after five years. This is a serious issue. I told Secretary Vance that I would have to refer it to my cabinet. In two or three weeks, we should be able to give you a discussion on this. I will notify you. I have to return to Israel, and then Foreign Minister Dayan must return from his trip to Scandinavia. It would be very gratifying if I could have the counterproposals from the Egyptians by then. We are all working for peace and we have to pave the way. There may be difficulties, that we will invest all of our thought in trying to think of ways to get agreement. This is a positive development.
The President: We will not be able to have complete discussions this afternoon, but I would like to comment briefly. President Sadat is remaining flexible and hopeful. We discussed with you last time the important issue of settlements, the issue of applicability of 242 to the West Bank which calls for withdrawal in exchange for security; and we discussed the question of dealing with the Palestinian issue and how they would have a right to participate in determining their own future. We discussed all these issues at length. I want to reconfirm our commitment to do what is necessary to insure that Israel’s security and integrity are protected. I also believe that in order for the moderate Arab leaders to have confidence in us will be in Israel’s best interest in the long run. There is no incompatibility between these two commitments—our commitment to Israel, and to those moderate Arab leaders who want peace.
[Page 1131]We have been reticent in making public statements that might concern you. Our own influence is limited. There is some tendency for each party to exaggerate our influence over the other. We want to be able to offer our good offices, which will always be available. We want you to have direct talks, and we hope those will be recommenced. That is the surest avenue to agreement.
The obstacle to discussions on Sadat’s part is his belief that there is not adequate flexibility in Israel, and that Israel does not contemplate any withdrawal from the West Bank even if there are negotiations. Egypt also fears that there will be no adequate voice for the Palestinians in the negotiations. These two concerns on Sadat’s part are serious but we believe that the impasse can be resolved.
We expect Egypt to make proposals. I have no idea what their content will be. This is a necessary next step. We take you at your word that you will address those proposals with an open mind and that they can be used as an avenue to reopen direct negotiations. We are waiting with anticipation for the Egyptian ideas. We pray that they will lead to a reopening of the negotiations.
Prime Minister Begin: We shall consider the Egyptian counterproposals with all seriousness. They may be different from our own view. That is the nature of negotiations. It will be a real achievement to get two proposals. We made our proposals. We wanted to show our desire for peace. They were far-reaching proposals, as you said. We have problems, we have anxieties, and this is natural. One has only to look at the map. It will take time, but there are very positive developments. We will eventually come together. You do have great influence with Israel. And we have great respect for your opinion, for your goodwill, and we are grateful to you for your helpful attitude. This is a blessed day. We have rediscovered the good atmosphere of last July.7
The President: This is an historic occasion. As Israel began as a nation thirty years ago, we hope that 1978 can mean the beginning of peace for Israel. I think this is a shared desire by Israel and its neighbors. All of the leaders are reaching out their hands in friendship. They may have some doubts about you, but I see this as their common desire. If Sadat only spoke for Egypt, he could reach an agreement, but he also represents other Arab nations and peoples. He feels this responsibility very heavily. I believe that of all the Arab leaders he wants peace more than any other. I know him and I know you, and I have no doubt about the deep and genuine feelings on both sides, and the desire to break down barriers, and to forget past disasters, wars, and hatreds, and to look to the future with confidence in the possibility of peace.
[Page 1132]President Sadat has told me that his most vivid impression after his visit to Jerusalem was the reaction of the Israeli and Egyptian peoples. Sadat noted the depth of feeling on the part of your young people and your women. He was also shocked by the reception that his people gave to your representatives.8 The desire for peace goes deeper than just the leaders. We hope that in a legitimate way we can help bridge differences. If we can help, we are eager to do so.
I have observed that there have been differences of interpretation in the media over our attitudes. I hope you won’t doubt our good intentions. I want you to be able to contact me directly if there are any matters that concern you. We had some problems in the debate over Panama. Sometimes the facts were distorted during the debate, and there were misunderstandings.
We won’t back down from the pursuit of peace. We are not doing this as a favor to the countries in the area, but rather because this is in the best interest of the United States. We will stand with Israel forever.
Prime Minister Begin: We shall do our best and we shall hope for the best. Thank you for seeing me.
The President: Let’s go to the Oval Office for a few minutes. (The President and Prime Minister Begin met alone for approximately ten minutes.)9
- Source: Carter Library, National Security Affairs, Brzezinski Material, Subject File, Box 36, Memcons: President: 5/78. Secret. The meeting took place in the White House Cabinet Room. The memorandum of conversation was drafted on May 3. Begin was in the United States from April 30 to May 7 on a private visit. This was his only meeting with Carter.↩
- A reference to the upcoming 30th anniversary of Israel’s founding, which was on May 14.↩
- See Documents 240 and 241.↩
- April 30.↩
- Carter’s remarks are in Public Papers: Carter, 1978, Book I, pp. 812–813.↩
- See Documents 232 and 234.↩
- A reference to Begin’s first meetings with Carter, which took place on July 19 and 20. See Documents 52 and 57.↩
- Apparently a reference to the Egyptian public response to Israeli officials who visited Egypt from December 25 to 26, 1977, to conduct direct negotiations.↩
- No memorandum of conversation has been found.↩