113. Memorandum of Telephone Conversation Between Dean Acheson and the Deputy Assistant Secretary of State for Far Eastern Affairs (Rice)0
Mr. Acheson talked with Mr. Rice in Mr. Hilsman’s absence. He said that he had been asked by mutual friends of Roger’s and his to talk about [Page 251] Sihanouk’s latest explosion1 and before doing so he thought he would ask questions of Roger and now of Mr. Rice. Mr. Acheson said that he was confused by one paragraph in his speech in which, after saying that December 31 is the deadline before everything goes to pieces, he would be willing to leave temporarily and give Son Ngoc Thanh a chance to run the country for a month. Mr. Acheson asked who this fellow is.
Mr. Rice said that Son Ngoc Thanh was an independence leader against the French; he could be described as quite brilliant but the sort of man not willing to be number two to anyone else. According to Mr. Rice’s recollection he tried to stage an overthrow of Sihanouk in 1959 but lost out. He and Sam Sary have been in opposition since. Sary does not have much following. Son Ngoc Thanh has a few hundred supporters in Thailand and Viet-Nam, poorly armed and poorly disciplined; he may have a certain amount of latent support in Cambodia.
Mr. Acheson said that he took it as a figure of speech and that he does not really want to leave the country.
Mr. Rice said that Sihanouk had said many things, some wild, and it is indeed uncertain that he really would be willing to give Son Ngoc Thanh a chance to run the country for a month. Mr. Rice said that telegrams received last night indicated that Sihanouk is backtracking. However, he still appeared to be insisting on the cessation of Khmer Serei broadcasts if he was to continue receiving Western aid. This was a preliminary report based on USIA people monitoring broadcasts. Evidently people have been talking with Sihanouk and have been putting second thoughts in his mind.
Mr. Acheson remarked that Sihanouk would be a great guy, if he wasn’t such a damned fool and didn’t say so many crazy things.
Mr. Rice said that he is often crazy like a fox.
Mr. Acheson agreed.
Mr. Acheson asked if we can stop the broadcasts.
Mr. Rice said that we would first have to find out where these stations are. If we go to the Thais and merely make noises about their being beastly to Sihanouk they will fly into their tantrum. We are aware of the desirability of having these shut down. Actually, if these stations are outside Cambodia, in Thailand and Viet-Nam, they should be shut down, whether he makes threats or not.
[2 paragraphs (2–1/2 lines of source text) not declassified]
Mr. Acheson said that he thought Ambassador Sprouse was very good.
[Page 252]In answer to Mr. Acheson’s question Mr. Rice said that when Phil went on leave he seemed to leave in good heart. Sihanouk sent him some expensive grapes from South Africa or Europe. Everything seemed friendly. While Phil was away things blew up. He has just returned and has sent a telegram or two assessing the situation.2
Mr. Acheson asked if the friendly greeting to Sihanouk went out last week.
Mr. Rice replied in the affirmative.3
Mr. Acheson thanked Mr. Rice and said he hoped he had not been indiscreet in asking these questions over the phone.
Mr. Rice said that he was not working on Far Eastern matters when Son Ngoc Thanh was in the limelight and what he gave Mr. Acheson was from memory but he did not think he was very far off.
- Source: Department of State, EA/Burma Union-Cambodia Files: Lot 66 D 492, 1963 Cambodia, July-December. No classification marking. Transcribed in Rice’s office.↩
- Apparent reference to Sihanouk’s ultimatum on U.S. and French aid; see footnote 1, Document 111.↩
- See Document 111.↩
- See footnote 7, Document 110.↩