Foreign Relations of the United States, 1969–1976, Volume E–11, Part 2, Documents on South America, 1973–1976

312. Memorandum of Conversation¹

New York, September 24, 1975, 5:40 p.m.

SUBJECT

• Secretary’s Meeting with Peruvian Foreign Minister de la Flor

PARTICIPANTS

• Peru

  • Foreign Minister de la Flor
  • Peruvian PermRep to the UN Silva
  • Foreign Office Spokesman Faura

• U.S.

  • The Secretary
  • Assistant Secretary William D. Rogers—ARA
  • John King, Notetaker
  • Anthony Herves, Interpreter

[Omitted here is a social exchange, a discussion of Kissinger’s proposed trip to Peru, and of the United Nations, Middle East and Africa.]

Foreign Minister: I would like now to go to a second point, which is that in connection with our problems with the United States we should attempt to find solutions through dialogue and in terms of the friendship and cooperation which have always existed between our two countries. We should in no way seek a confrontation that causes frictions.

The Secretary: That is our attitude also.

Foreign Minister: That is what my President, General Morales Bermudez, told me just before I left for the U.S. to tell you: We believed that after signing the Greene agreement that all our problems were put aside. Then we had the Braniff problem, and now we have another problem relating to the nationalization of Marcona. This is a question I have already discussed with Secretary Rogers during the special session, and I hope this will not become a problem between the United States and the Government of Peru.

The Secretary: Certainly not, if you yield. I want to make it diplomatically easy for you.

No, look, I don’t want you to yield. We have to work something out here.

Foreign Minister: We have talked with Marcona and found them to be intransigent. (Faura’s translation: “A waste of time.”) We feel that continuing these conversations would not lead anywhere.

From the point of view of my government, we have a law which exists—for better or for worse, but it exists—and our new President, Morales Bermudez, feels that to derogate such a law would carry too great a political risk.

The Secretary: But does that have to be done? We don’t want you to change your law.

Foreign Minister: The question therefore is whether we can exchange ideas between our two governments for a viable formula to settle the question in a manner that satisfies both sides.

The Secretary: (Nodding to Secretary Rogers) If you can’t settle with them then it’s not possible. Rogers is our specialist in surrender. He’s basically a Democrat and I’m going to use him as my safe-conduct if they win the next election. He alienates all the conservatives by agreeing to the expropriation of American property in Latin America. He gives away the Panama Canal. He reestablishes relations with Cuba.

Foreign Minister: That is precisely what has contributed to improving relations with Latin America, which looks on all these steps you are taking as very positive. We feel that another very important point in your relations with Latin America is that some private U.S. companies with property and interests in Latin America have not shown an honest and positive attitude in dealing with Latin America. But I will refer to one company that has observed all our laws and maintained the best relations in Peru, and that is the Southern Peru Copper Company.

The Secretary: I think what we should do . . . We have no intention of getting into a conflict because of private companies in Peru, and Bill (Rogers) will cooperate in seeking a settlement that respects Peruvian law and national dignity.

Foreign Minister: We most deeply appreciate your statements here and I feel confident that we are going to be able to maintain good relations.

The Secretary: (Escorting de la Flor to the elevator) I’ll be down in the next three or three-and-a-half months.

1. Summary: Kissinger and de la Flor discussed bilateral economic issues, in particular compensation for expropriated companies.

   Source: National Archives, RG 59, Central Foreign Policy File, P820123–2530. Confidential; Nodis. Drafted by King. Kissinger and de la Flor were attending the UNGA in New York. On September 29, the Secretary’s Delegation sent a summary of the memorandum of conversation to the Department. (Telegram Secto 14009, September 29; ibid., P840126–2330) The Greene Agreement was the February 19, 1974, U.S.-Peruvian agreement regarding compensation for expropriated companies. It is discussed in Document 296. In telegram 5210 from Lima, June 30, 1975, the Embassy reported that the U.S. and Peruvian delegations had initialed an understanding with regard to Braniff’s air routes. (Ibid., D750226–0512)