Office of the Historian

117. Memorandum of Conversation1

Washington, December 19, 1979

SUBJECT

  • Meeting with Ali El-Houderi, Libyan People’s Bureau

PARTICIPANTS

  • Ali El-Houderi, Secretary, People’s Committee, Libyan People’s Bureau
  • David D. Newsom, Under Secretary for Political Affairs
  • William L. Eagleton, Jr., US Charge, Tripoli
  • Richard Jackson—P
  • W. Alan Roy, Libyan Desk Officer, NEA/AFN (Notetaker)

Ali El-Houderi, head of the Libyan People’s Bureau in Washington, came to the Department at his request for a meeting with Under Secretary Newsom. He opened the meeting with a brief recital of the recent messages that have been sent to Washington by the Libyan Government, citing particularly the two messages from Col. Qadhafi to President Carter (Note: message of November 29 and December 12)2 and the December 3 message from Foreign Secretary Turayki.3 He suggested that these messages constituted an answer to Mr. Newsom’s demarche made to El-Houderi on December 5,4 but indicated that, for the record, he wanted to specifically answer Mr. Newsom directly. He emphasized that what he had to say was not his own message but [Page 288] rather a summation of messages previously sent and assurances he received during his consultations in Tripoli. Specifically, he indicated that:

—The Libyan Government regretted the attack on the Embassy and fully accepted its responsibility to provide adequate security to foreign diplomats.

—His government was fully prepared to pay compensation for damage done to the Embassy and that this willingness was a clear recognition of the Libyan Government’s “failure” and “negligence” in not providing adequate security for the Embassy.

—Col. Qadhafi has given his personal assurance to President Carter that full and adequate protection will be provided to all Americans in Libya so they might live in a “climate of freedom and security”.

El-Houderi expressed in general terms his hope and expectation that a “new page had been turned” in US/Libyan relations and that we both need to “forgive and forget”. He expressed his optimism about the future of our bilateral relations and the hope that the “momentum” now in train would not be allowed to slacken.

Newsom replied to El-Houderi by welcoming the assurances given and indicating that we will “accept them at face value”. He made it clear, however, that we still would like to see the assurances of future security put into more tangible form. Specifically, he suggested that security units be designated to provide protection for the Embassy and that the Embassy have well established access to these units. In addition he proposed that Charge Eagleton upon his return to Tripoli, be accorded an early meeting with Col. Qadhafi to discuss the various issues affecting the operation of our Embassy in Tripoli.

Mr. Newsom, at this point, brought up something which he described as a “troubling problem” which occurs at the “worst possible time”—specifically the arrest and ongoing detention of Bashir Dultz, a German national who has been the budget and fiscal officer at the Embassy for many years. When serving as Ambassador in Tripoli, Newsom knew Dultz well and has high regard for him. He indicated that this arrest sent all of the wrong signals at a time when Libyan authorities were trying to assure us of future security. He noted particularly that the arrest was causing great nervousness among both national and American employees at the Embassy and that the loss of Dultz’ skill as a B&F officer was causing serious difficulty in getting the Embassy reorganized. Newsom made it clear that while Dultz’ release was not a condition of improved relations, his release or a full explanation of his arrest would certainly improve the “atmosphere”.

Ali El-Houderi indicated that he had no direct knowledge of the Dultz case, but was certain that the arrest had nothing to do with the [Page 289] Embassy. He suggested that Dultz was well known in Tripoli and many believed he was a “spy”. Nonetheless, he undertook to bring the case to the attention of senior Libyan officials and to pursue it when he goes back to Tripoli later this month. El-Houderi returned to the theme of improved relations and expressed the expectation that while problems still exist, they can and will be worked out.

  1. Source: Carter Library, National Security Affairs, Staff Material, Middle East, Subject File, Box 61, Libya: 1–12/79. Confidential. Drafted by Roy. The meeting took place in Newsom’s office.↩
  2. For the November 29 message, see footnote 3, Document 113. The December 12 message was not found.↩
  3. Not found. Presumably it was a response to Vance’s message in Document 109.↩
  4. See Document 111.↩