420. Memorandum of Conversation1
SUBJECT
- Turkish Prime Minister Calls on President
PARTICIPANTS
- Turkish:
- His Excellency Suleyman Demirel, Prime Minister
- His Excellency Ihsan Sabri Caglayangil, Foreign Minister
- His Excellency Melih Esenbel, Turkish Ambassador
- United States:
- The President
- Mr. Henry A. Kissinger, Assistant to the President for National Security Affairs
- Mr. Frank E. Cash, Jr., Country Director, Turkish Affairs
The President began by saying we were most honored that the Prime Minister and Foreign Minister had come for the funeral; General EISENHOWER had had a warm spot in his heart for Turkey.2
The Prime Minister said the Turks had felt it their duty to pay their respects to a great man, who had served the entire free world. They were grateful the President had had time for this meeting, which was a good occasion for an exchange of views.
The President said a lot had happened, and the world had changed. One thing he wished the Turks to be aware of was that the US and Turkey were good friends, and his philosophy was not to take friends for granted. He knew the Turks had been required to face great risks with great courage and hoped the US could reciprocate. If the Turkish Government should ever feel that its relations with the US were not what they should be, the President hoped matters would be discussed at the ambassadorial level or at the top level.
The Prime Minister commented that as a matter of fact very good relations are maintained by the respective governments and people; he saw no reason why this should not continue, as he felt it to be beneficial to both countries. New conditions are being created all over the world, and new generations which have not known the sufferings of war want a better life. Today most countries desire peace wherever freedom of press, elections, and a multi-party system exist. One fact, however, should not be missed; international communism has not changed its objective, but merely its tactics.
These new tactics, the President commented, are more difficult to deal with than the old.
The Communists, the Prime Minister continued, now prefer to create problems inside developing countries taking advantage of the democratic system, itself, in order to undermine it. If a government tries to curb these efforts, there is a loud outcry. In such a situation, all democratic countries should stick together; things are not less difficult today than they were twenty years ago. For example, there is China, about which we know very little.
The President agreed saying it would be better if we knew more. Countries should cooperate in informing the public better. What, he asked, should we be doing about all this?
Development, Demirel responded emphatically, is the only way out. If this is successful, things will be fine; if not, we have problems. Turkey is a good example. The Turks will succeed and are grateful for what the US has done to help.
[Page 1039]The President responded that the Turks had done a lot to help themselves.
Demirel said that in six or seven years Turkey hoped to be a contributing country.
The President asked whether there was time; young people today are very impatient.
There is no alternative, Demirel responded.
The President said he thought the Prime Ministerʼs analysis was very perceptive. The world has indeed changed in the last twenty years, and Soviet tactics—but not objectives—have changed. However, Soviet needs have also changed. They now need friends in the West since they must watch both West and East. What would be the effect, the President asked, of possible US–USSR talks? As that kind of détente develops—if it does develop—is this going to weaken other countriesʼ desire to remain strong?
The Prime Minister said he felt talks were fine but should be conducted carefully so as to avoid the possible danger the President had indicated, in order that other countries not lose confidence in the Alliance.
The President said he wanted to emphasize that the US is keenly aware of its responsibilities to have the fullest discussion with its friends in order to get their advice and suggestions, not just to inform them. US decisions vis-à-vis the Soviets will have an enormous effect in the US, but also on other countries counting on the US. Therefore, we think we have responsibilities going beyond just the US and the USSR, and we wish to have the closest of relations with the Turkish Government as we proceed.
The Prime Minister said his Government felt that all countries which believe in freedom should not create problems for their allies. Sometimes, however, this cannot be helped. During the last couple of years the Turks have developed better relations with the Soviets, but this has nothing to do with Turkish commitments to friends and allies. These will continue in the future.
The President said he thought Turkish interests were the same as US interests. The Soviet Union is Turkeyʼs neighbor. There may be difficulties, but they can be discussed. The President said he had always believed in frank talks with the Soviets making clear that each had a different view of the world. Each had a right to such views, but both must try to reduce the risk of conflict over their differences. This, in the Presidentʼs view, was what the Turks were doing.
The President mentioned that Iran was acting similarly.
The Prime Minister commented that Iran and Turkey have good relations and are both members of CENTO, but the latter organization is not as strong as it once was.
[Page 1040]In response to the Presidentʼs request for advice on the Middle East, the Prime Minister said the President was, of course, aware of the situation in the Mediterranean and the Soviet presence. Syria is becoming worse and worse. Turkey is trying to keep Iraq from developing in this direction. Middle East crises should not become international crises; they should be settled locally. Both sides, including the Arabs, should be listened to and understood. Israel should withdraw from the occupied territories. It is difficult for one Arab nation to begin talks alone. Pressure must be put on both sides.
While the UN can serve as the locus of a settlement, it cannot settle the problem.
In response to the Presidentʼs question about the situation in Egypt, the Prime Minister commented that the UAR is wholly dependent on the Soviets.
The meeting concluded at 5:10 P.M. with the Prime Minister saying that Turkey and the US are good friends and allies, and the President saying we hope to keep it that way.