82. Memorandum of Conversation0
SUBJECT
- U.S. Troop Reductions in Europe
PARTICIPANTS
- Germans
- Dr. Gerhard Schroeder, Foreign Minister, Federal Republic of Germany
- Ambassador Karl Heinrich Knappstein, German Embassy
- Dr. Albert Reinkemeyer, Deputy Assistant Secretary, Foreign Office
- Mr. Heinz Weber, Counselor-Interpreter
- Americans
- The President
- Acting Secretary Ball
- Ambassador George C. McGhee, American Embassy, Bonn
- Assistant Secretary William R. Tyler, EUR
- Mr. Richard B. Finn, Deputy Director, GER
The President said that he also wished to talk about troop reductions in Europe.1 He noted that there had been a problem arising from the withdrawal of 600 US troops from the Berlin Garrison. He said that the US has very large forces abroad and an extensive logistics line, which has been set up almost on a wartime basis. The United States maintains around 300,000 men in Europe. The President said that the US does not want to take actions which would have an adverse impact on public opinion in Germany but does not wish to keep spending money to maintain forces which are not of real value. Mr. Ball commented that these reductions relate to non-combat units.
Mr. Schroeder said that the important thing is to have detailed talks in advance so that objectives are made clear and public opinion can be clarified. Otherwise people in Germany would think the US was reducing its forces as a result of some arrangement between the US and the Soviet Union. The important thing is to explain these matters in advance and to carry out the reductions at an appropriate time.
The President said that the US would discuss these matters with the Federal Republic as the situation develops. In the case of US forces in Germany, the President said the arguments against reductions at this time are more powerful than the arguments in favor.
[Page 187]Mr. Schroeder said there are positive aspects to these reductions. The US always maintains large numbers of supporting units with its divisions. If some of these units are withdrawn, this may have an effect on German performance. The Foreign Minister repeated that the Federal Republic would be agreeable to withdrawals if there were good preparation in advance.
The President noted that these reductions involve about 18,000 men, largely in France, Britain and Spain. He emphasized that the US would stay in close touch with the Federal Republic on this subject.
Mr. Schroeder stated that the decisive point is that German public opinion should feel that there has been frank consultation. He commented that Germany is a little different perhaps in this respect. When the President went to Berlin, his statements were of great importance and were well received. Nevertheless the US is at some distance from Germany and the German people feel the need for an “allowance” of goodwill and understanding.
The President said he understood this point. He was glad that he had been able to go to Germany to show the interest of the U.S. and our understanding of the German situation. It is probably hard for the German people to understand clearly some of the problems which the United States considers of major importance, such as the race problem and Cuba.
As the meeting broke up Mr. Ball said it had been a very unusual meeting since the subject of poultry had not been discussed. The President emphasized his interest in an early solution of the problem. Mr. Schroeder said that he was very aware of this matter and that the Federal Republic had been working for what it hoped would be a solution of the problem of poultry levies.
The meeting ended at 11:35 a.m.
- Source: Department of State, Presidential Memoranda of Conversation: Lot 66 D 149, July-September 1963. Secret. Drafted by Richard B. Finn (EUR/GER) on September 30 and approved by U on September 30 and the White House on October 4.↩
- For additional documentation on decisions leading to troop reductions in Europe, see Documents 26 ff.↩