740.00119 EW/6–2246
Memorandum of Conversation, by the Secretary of State
| Participants: | Mr. Carandini, Italian Ambassador to Great Britain, and |
| The Secretary |
The Italian Ambassador to Great Britain called at his request on the Secretary this morning. He said he had a personal message from Prime Minister de Gasperi for the Secretary. He stated that the Prime Minister was very well satisfied with the status of internal conditions [Page 577] in Italy. He referred to Mr. Molotov’s concern over the situation in Italy and said there was no cause for worry; that for several days prior to the departure of the King it was a period of uncertainty but that the departure was arranged and effected so that the King could leave the country with the respect and sympathy of the people, and the country was now quiet.
The Ambassador continued that the Prime Minister’s principal concern was the coincidence of the coming of the peace with the birth of the new democracy and republic in Italy. He said that if they should now receive a blow, no government of Italy could resist it in as much as up to the present moment everything has moved along smoothly—i.e., elections, employment, etc.
The Secretary in reply stated that these views had already been presented to the U.S. in a letter from Prime Minister de Gasperi to the President.78 He stated he used this letter in presenting the P.M.’s views to the Council of Foreign Ministers. As to Trieste, any democratic government would find it difficult to agree to turn it over to Yugoslavia at this time and that it was not very difficult to realize that this was a serious problem. He then mentioned the problem of the colonies. He said he thought it was a wise agreement in May when they couldn’t agree upon settlement, to postpone final solution for a year in view of the fact that there were so many conflicting views at this time. He thought that at the end of twelve months the people would get to look upon the problem more calmly—after the restlessness of the war period and elections had passed—and the Council of Foreign Ministers could then get together and reach a final solution.
The Ambassador referred to the question of Italian reparations, stating that they know that Mr. Bevin voted against consideration of Italian reparations. The Ambassador said they felt they should be allowed to present their views on this question. He explained that it was not their wish to appear before the Foreign Ministers, but merely to present their views to the British and American experts to see if some satisfactory method of payment could not be worked out and presented to the Russians.
The Ambassador continued that the problem of the industrialists of Italy was in securing raw materials with which to produce goods to turn over as reparations to the Soviet Union. The Soviets are asking for the industrialists’ machinery in lieu of manufactured goods and this constituted a serious threat to Italian economy. The Ambassador said that because of the dearth of raw materials the only thing they [Page 578] could offer at the present time was good will with a promise to deliver goods when they are able to secure enough raw materials. He stressed the fact that it would be tragic if they had to deliver the machinery at this time. He said the Russians are insisting on obtaining goods out of current production, or the machinery.
The Ambassador mentioned British suspicion that the Italian industrialists were in favor of delivering manufactured goods to Russia just to deliver goods to Russia. He said they suspected a secret understanding or agreement between Italy and the Soviets, and he denied that such an agreement existed.
The Secretary said he had talked to Mr. Molotov about reparations payments and that Molotov had several times stated that Italy would be consulted on this question.
The Ambassador replied that they had no understanding with the Russians. He repeated that the main fear of the Italian industrialists was that their machinery would be taken from them. He said that what they would like to do would be to pay their reparation debt in a lump sum; but even though they were to give up their machinery in payment it would not cover the whole sum which they must pay, as they did not possess much heavy machinery.
The Secretary mentioned ships as possible payment, and the Ambassador replied that Italy was so short of ships that it would be a terrific sacrifice for her to have to give up ships.
The Secretary mentioned the fact that one of the Italian ministers had submitted a proposal last summer to Russia to enter into a commercial agreement to deliver electrical fixtures, which would indicate that Italy was not in such a bad fix.
The Ambassador replied that it was impossible for Italy to supply Russia with electrical supplies. That agreement was based on Russia’s furnishing the raw materials. He said that a few months ago Russia proposed that Italy build ships for her in Italy’s shipyards. He said that Russia would not furnish the raw materials. This put in a difficult position as they could not give a reply one way or the other. He said Italy was not opposed to the principle but that she did not have the raw materials.
The Ambassador said they were very much concerned over Russian propaganda in Italy and stated that this was not an Italian game with the Russians but a Russian game in Italy. He said, in conclusion, that he wished to convey to the Secretary the faithful expressions of Prime Minister de Gasperi and stressed the fact that the P.M. was in a very difficult position at this moment.
The Secretary replied that he was fully aware of the difficult position which the Prime Minister occupied.