Foreign Relations of the United States, 1969–1976, Volume E–9, Part 2, Documents on the Middle East Region, 1973–1976

102. Memorandum of Conversation¹

Riyadh, March 2, 1974.

PARTICIPANTS

• Prince Fahd, Deputy Prime Minister, Saudi Arabia
• The Saudi Chief of Royal Protocol
• Henry A. Kissinger, Secretary of State
• James Akins, US Ambassador to Saudi Arabia
• Joseph J. Sisco, Under Secretary of State
• Harold H. Saunders, NSC Staff
• Issa Sabbagh, American Interpreter

Kissinger: I am very happy to be here again. Your hospitality is overwhelming, and I gain weight every time I come here.

Fahd: I am very pleased that you like coming, even though I am sorry it causes you to put on weight.

Kissinger: I have no will power when it comes to good food.

Fahd: It’s normal when one is on the hungry side as you must be on these trips, that one “dives in.” I am very pleased to see you in such good health and in our country. I know that your work is most taxing.

Kissinger: One of the advantages of working in this area is that I am dealing with people I like. It is not like negotiating with the North Vietnamese.

Fahd: Thank the Lord for that. We follow the news of your negotiations with great interest. We pray to Almighty God that your health and energy last and that the results of your work will be successful. Of first importance to us is the US-Saudi bilateral relationship.

Kissinger: That is also very important to us and on this trip I want to pay particular attention to this subject. When the embargo is lifted, we hope to be able to exchange missions to discuss the important economic subjects that are so significant a part of our relationship.

Fahd: This is excellent. Our country is developing, and we need technical help.

Kissinger: We have made very extensive studies. We are prepared to discuss very large projects in Saudi Arabia and in the US. Our thought is to create some joint commissions.

Fahd: That is very good.

Kissinger: I hope you can come to the United States on a visit very soon.

Fahd: Thank you. As you know, Saudi Arabia in the past could not afford vast expansion projects. Now we can, and we want to work them out in cooperation with the United States. As you know, the European countries want long-term projects with us but we have declined because we want a close relationship with the US.

Kissinger: We want such a relationship because our security interests are parallel. We both want to keep out the Communists and those dominated by the Communists. We want to help with the domestic stability of our friends. We have always considered Saudi Arabia our natural ally in this area. We are prepared to extend our cooperation further into the security field and to send a military mission here, or you could send a military mission to Washington. But above all, we should plan for 10 years. We can give you whatever technical advice you feel you need.

Fahd: This is very excellent. I agree with the need to exchange missions and to absorb the latest techniques. We are proud of our security program here, but we want the latest techniques.

Kissinger: In the economic field, we are prepared to develop long-term projects and scientific exchanges.

Fahd: This is excellent. Our thinking is that there should be joint capital because both sides will take the projects more seriously. I would like to see Saudi capital invested in the US. The American people would begin to see the fruits of our relationship. I would also like to see American capital invested here for the same reason.

Kissinger: We would be prepared to discuss some protection against inflation when you invest in the US. We have studied how this might be done. At the right moment, you could send an expert to the US or we could send one here.

Fahd: I hope that you have been successful in your visits to Syria and Israel.

Kissinger: You know that they are both very difficult, but we have made progress. Israel will send a representative to Washington in about 10 days, then Syria will send a representative to Washington after that. Then we will begin to shape the negotiations.

Fahd: As long as the first basic steps have been taken, then the next step can be taken over a sure path. No one expects progress overnight.

Kissinger: In November, I told His Majesty that we would make every effort to make progress in Egypt. This is more difficult on the Syrian-Israeli front.

Fahd: I admire your motto: Let action speak.

Kissinger: My Saudi friends have shown great patience.

Fahd: Precisely because our interests are common interests, we can pursue a common goal. I would like to emphasize my own viewpoint—that the Soviet Union and Communist China do not want stability in this area.

Kissinger: The Soviets are very angry with me. I notice that Gromyko is now following me around the area. Now it appears that he is going back to Syria.

Fahd: It is very important to see that the policy of Egypt under President Sadat is consistent with King Faisal’s policy.

Kissinger: Yes, that is a great change and a very important one.

Fahd: That is very true. I hope that what also can be achieved is to attract Syria into this group.

Kissinger: Perhaps if disengagement can be achieved in Syria, that can be accomplished.

Fahd: I agree. My opinion is that Asad is a reasonable, moderate man. He is, however, subject to pressures from the Baath Party, from the Soviet Union, and from the Palestinians.

Kissinger: I like him personally well enough, but he is tough.

Fahd: True. I got to know him first when he came here to Saudi Arabia. As he gets to know you better, he becomes more flexible. Of course, we are speaking as friends when I say that sort of thing. We are very much interested in the status of Jordan and of King Hussein. We have heard rumors that the United States is decreasing its support for Jordan.

Kissinger: Some people report that we are no longer interested in King Hussein. Were you referring to that?

Fahd: No.

Kissinger: Those rumors are not true.

Fahd: Of course, every person can have his own interpretation. My view is that if King Hussein left the West Bank, then he would avoid a lot of problems.

Kissinger: You don’t think he should negotiate with Israel over the West Bank?

Fahd: Yes, it would be a good thing if he were to negotiate. But there would be a conflict if the Palestinians were also negotiating for the same thing at the same time. But there might be some advantage for King Hussein to step aside from the West Bank for the time being.

Kissinger: Another school of thought is that King Hussein should negotiate with Israel for the return of the West Bank and then turn it over to the Palestinians because Israel will not negotiate with the Palestinians.

Fahd: That would also be good. It is true that the problems of the Palestinians are different. A solution of the problem of the Palestinians would help bring a solution for the whole area. There will be problems in Lebanon. But after all the parties concerned realize that all are working in cooperation, then we can relax.

Kissinger: There was hostility between Egypt and Israel at the start, but now that relationship is working much more smoothly. We hope that eventually Syria can be brought into this process. Maybe it can even happen on the West Bank.

Fahd: Of course. It is natural that when things begin to settle down, progress will begin to emerge.

Kissinger: This is why Syrian disengagement is so important.

Fahd: True. It will cause the Syrians to think more moderately.

Kissinger: Also the Israelis. But I have found even since November that the mood in the area has become more relaxed.

Fahd: That is absolutely true. Your efforts in Egypt have shown that results could be accomplished. This has caused us to relax. We sincerely hope that the problem on the Syrian front will be solved. We are concerned about Iraq and South Yemen. We fear that there is a pincers movement working between them.

Kissinger: That is our view. That is why we must work together. You have our complete support.

Fahd: The Soviets will be concentrating on these two.

Kissinger: They already are. This will be even more true now since the Soviets feel that Egypt is loosening its relationship with the USSR.

Fahd: It is my belief that the Syrians will follow the same course. I got this feeling from Asad and from the Deputy Prime Minister and the Economic Minister from Syria. All expressed a serious desire to get rid of Soviet influence. They want to break away from past practices and settle down to their own development.

Kissinger: I have the impression that they want good relations with the US.

Fahd: Yes. I believe that is a fact. I detect that myself, and they asked me to pass it on.

Kissinger: Whenever you want to pass a message to the Syrians, you can say that the US attaches great importance to the improvement of its relationships with Syria and that on all bilateral matters we will meet them more than half-way.

Fahd: I will particularly mention this. I am going to Syria. I did not want to say anything without having touched base with you.

Kissinger: You would be doing an act of great friendship if you would say this. We will discuss all matters in this context. We agree that Saudi Arabia and Egypt are moving together now in a better way than they have in the past. If Syria could join them, then the Soviets and the radicals would have less influence and they could not achieve so much.

Fahd: Of course, our position and Syria’s have been very different in the past. Now, we have several invitations to visit Syria. The last of these was issued to His Majesty during the Algiers Conference. Asad has also extended an invitation to me to visit Syria.

Kissinger: I would appreciate knowing your reactions when you return.

Fahd: Of course, I shall convey them to the Ambassador. I always like to see your Ambassador. We get together often. When our wives are angry with us it is nice to find a friend.

Kissinger: As long as he is not angry with Your Highness.

Fahd: Misery likes company.

Kissinger: We have great confidence in our Ambassador.

Fahd: In San Francisco, at the Fairmont Hotel in the basement there is a place where women are not admitted. Husbands who are peeved at their wives can go there and let steam off.

Kissinger: In Saudi Arabia, women are under very good control.

Fahd: There is not much mixing. Inevitably it is going to happen. It cannot be escaped.

Kissinger: You can delay it.

Fahd: Yes, we can postpone it.

Kissinger: Once you loosen the controls, it is hard to get them back again.

Fahd: I would like to reiterate our warm welcome to you. My confidence and His Majesty’s confidence in your efforts to resolve these problems is great. And it is important that we develop our relationship together in the fields of common interests.

Kissinger: Your Highness can count on our continuing our peace efforts. Second, we will have talks as soon as possible on joint projects to strengthen our bilateral relationship. Your Highness is always welcome in Washington for this or any other purpose. Third, we are prepared to coordinate our policy with Saudi Arabia very closely as far as the Arabian Peninsula is concerned. We consider the enemies of Saudi Arabia our own enemies.

Fahd: I was very pleased to hear from Foreign Minister Saqqaf after his meeting with President Nixon and with you in Washington.

Kissinger: If I may say one other thing, we do not want to discuss this in detail, but I do want you to know that President Nixon is under the impression from Saqqaf that at the next meeting of the Arab oil ministers, the embargo will be lifted. For the US it is a question of dignity not to be pressed by our friends. We expect this to happen in the very near future. After that, we can start all of the projects we discussed.

Fahd: I would like to assure you that His Majesty is very interested in “repumping” the oil. Actually this is of moral significance. We see some value to it. This embargo has forestalled those who want to fish in troubled waters.

Kissinger: Now it is a blight on our relationship. If there is another delay in lifting the embargo, there will be a very serious crisis of confidence. Now it is a weapon for the Israelis, not for the Arabs.

Fahd: I hope the petroleum will be repumped as soon as possible because the last few days I have noticed His Majesty is very much interested in this.

Kissinger: This has been a very good talk. Let me renew my invitation for Your Highness to make an early visit to the US.

Fahd: Thank you for extending this invitation again. The person-to-person relationship is very important.

Kissinger: Yes, it is very important because it builds mutual confidence.

1. Summary: Prince Fahd and Kissinger discussed security, the status of Arab-Israeli peace negotiations, and other subjects.

   Source: National Archives, Nixon Presidential Materials, NSC Files, Box 1028, Presidential/HAK MemCons, March 1–May 8, 1974. Secret; Nodis. Drafted by Saunders on March 8. The meeting took place at Prince Fahd’s Palace. Kissinger stopped in Riyadh as part of his February 26–March 2 shuttle, stopping also in Cairo, Damascus, and Amman. For the records of these meetings, see Foreign Relations, 1969–1976, vol. XXVI, Arab-Israeli Dispute, 1974–1976, Document 25–29.