88. Transcript of a Telephone Conversation Between President Nixon and his Assistant for National Security Affairs (Kissinger)1

P: Did you get a good bill of health.

K: Yes. They have to check the lab tests.

P: You think you will live. On this Cambodia thing I noted in the news summaries that they are very pessimistic with Cronkite reporting they have just three weeks to survive.

K: That is completely ridiculous. Unless our intelligence is all wrong. Have one unit in that area. Same troop as in Kompong Cham area. We have solved the problem that concerned you the other day. We are getting South Vietnamese airlift to get the troops in—the South Vietnamese that is. According to your orders the supplies are going in with American planes.2

P: They can do that. Supplies is fine. They are there to unload the supplies if they are needed too.

K: That’s Vietnamese troops.

P: I understand.

K: That thing is going to start tomorrow night. That will relieve pressure on that village that was in the news. Then in 2 weeks to 6 weeks from now when the rainy season is over and the roads dry up . . .

P: Did the bombing strikes do any good?

K: We tripled and quadrupled . . . The only thing is we only have Cambodian ground observers and we can’t really tell. But it did help morale. That thing I talked to you about yesterday is starting on Thursday.3 25,000 SVN, ______, 10,000 Cambodians . . . Then in three weeks going to do the other thing. That will deal with the tip of it. We will have to wait until Haig comes back to see if we want to go ahead with the other things.

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P: Do we have a plan of bombing of choke points in the North yet?

K: My recommendation is to wait until we get all plans together (mention made of alternatives) and tie it up with whatever else we want to do, otherwise we will be piddling around over there and everyone will be raising hell with every little thing. We have to wait until the roads dry out. The rainy season lasted a month longer than we thought it would. That is why the week of Jan. 1st was chosen.

[Omitted here is unrelated discussion.]

P: Isn’t it something that two major networks broadcast and believe this bullshit about Cambodia?

K: I have looked at the situation—unless our intelligence is so bad that we are totally misled. Intelligence says there are only 3,000 North Vietnamese in there. . . . Today for example we have solved the oil problem. I just talked with Adm. Moorer and they are sending it up the Mekong. When a road is cut it takes them a long time to get to the cut place but then they open it up. They only open up as far as they need to travel. Road between Sihanoukville and Phnom Penh is cut now and we have moved in some South Vietnamese troops because they are more quick on their feet . . . 1100 North Vietnamese in that whole general area. Now they have just small forces in there. Several weeks from now when some of their forces start moving in (after rainy season) we will have a problem with massive troops.

P: We do have a preemptive move planned don’t we?

K: We have several. One starting early in January. It cannot begin now because roads are water logged. Right now we are fine but it is the dry season that we have to worry about.

P: Fine. It is interesting to note that some senators are squealing about . . . gave Laird a tough time about bombing. Mansfield was restrained. They are in the wrong wicket. Not everyone feels this way.

K: I was at the French Embassy last night at a party. Nancy Dickerson is no heavy weight but she said to Mike Mansfield who was sitting beside her that she could not see how to argue with the rationale that as long as we are pulling out there is no reason why we should not maintain enough force while we are doing it. That is the reaction I get from many people.

P: It will be if it continues too long. The press gave hardly any play to our low casualties—being down to 27. It was a good thing that I got it in the press conference. We reached about 40,000,000 with the press conference.4

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K: It was a spectular success. Apparently Novak said . . . one news summary said that you seemed scared.

P: (laughter) scared!?

K: Even Kay Graham (she was at the party last night) said you were outstanding last night. She didn’t know why press wanted more conferences because you always got the better of them.

P: People are just trying to create an impression with someone who did not see it.

K: Substance and Non-substance—the impression you made was good. That bit about the mistake you made when ______ had no question and then you said we would go to the right or the left—whichever way you turned. It was great.

  1. Source: National Archives, Nixon Presidential Materials, Kissinger Telephone Conversations, Box 8, Chronological File. No classification marking. A note at the top indicates that the transcriber paraphrased the conversation. All omissions are in the original.
  2. In a December 11 telephone conversation, Moorer informed Kissinger that Laird had approved a Cambodian operation using only ARVN personnel, but it would take a few days to implement. He noted that he was organizing the operation by telephone. Kissinger indicated his approval and asked, “Now will you bomb around Kampong Cham because the President is driving me out of my mind?” Moorer responded that the military had tripled the sorties in the area. (Transcript of telephone conversation, December 11; ibid.)
  3. December 17.
  4. Nixon is referring to his December 10 news conference. The text is in Public Papers: Nixon, 1970, pp. 1101–1111.