186. Transcript of a Telephone Conversation Between the President’s Assistant for National Security (Kissinger) and the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff (Moorer)1
K: Tom, OK. Where are you?
M: I’m at home.
K: Oh, Tom, I don’t know whether Hanoi got to you.
M: Yes he did.
K: But the President was having absolute fits about that Abrams thing.2
M: You mean what’s in the paper this morning.3
K: Yeh. Now my problem is—you know they have all gone through hell for a few weeks and we finally got Vietnam off the front pages and we don’t want to get it there again if we can avoid it.
M: Right.
K: On the other hand we want these operations to go forward. And you know what is going to happen if this draws too much flack and we give a directive to Laird to cool it, how he will interpret it.
M: Yeh.
[Page 564]K: Now I don’t know what possessed Abrams to tell you the truth. I mean when I read the Post account he actually walked up to these newsmen.4
M: Yeh, that is what it said. I mean after having been . . .
K: After having been clear of them.
M: That’s the way they presented it but I don’t know if that is actually what happened or not. Yeh, I don’t know why he did that either other than of course this is more the idea—get across the idea that the South Vietnamese are still there active.
K: But the demonstrations are coming up this week. I think at this stage of the game as long as people think we know what we are doing, it isn’t in our interest to get a big debate started as long as we continue doing what we are doing.
M: I couldn’t agree with you more.
K: Don’t you think?
M: Of course. Well I will get the word out there to him. I guess the damage is done now although I think that the least said about it the better right now . . .
K: But can’t we keep them—it also mentioned somebody, the 101st Airborne—can’t they just shut up for awhile out there?
M: I will get that word out. Don’t worry.
K: Because believe me we’re doing our best to try to keep operations going.
M: I will get that through to everybody, Henry. [everyone’s asleep]5 now but I will see that they get it first thing in the morning. Their morning.
K: OK. Not to stop what they are doing. Just to stop talking.
M: Absolutely, I understand.
K: Tom, have a good Sunday.
M: Right. They’ll get the word. Tell the President that they will get the word.
K: Right. Oh Tom, Zumwalt was over the other day on a few—on a social call. And there were a few Navy things he raised which I told [Page 565] him to take up with you too. And I just want you to know that he said he would. It wasn’t—it was just he had been very nice to me so I had him over for lunch. It wasn’t anything official.
M: All right. I’ll see him tomorrow.
K: Right.
M: Thank you. Good bye.
- Source: National Archives, Nixon Presidential Materials, Kissinger Telephone Conversations, Box 9, Chronological File. No classification marking. The time of the conversation is unknown. A note on the transcript indicates that Kissinger’s secretary typed it on May 7.↩
- According to the President’s Daily Diary, Kissinger spoke on the telephone with the President at the following times on April 18: 10:23-10:35 a.m.; 10:41-10:48 a.m.; and 1:28-1:36 p.m. (Ibid., White House Central Files) According to a transcript of one of those conversations, Nixon stated: “The thing is that this is what the press is trying to do. They want a story. It doesn’t make any difference what he [Abrams] does. I don’t care if he goes in and bombs the hell out of them, but don’t say it. The press want to put Vietnam back on the front pages. This one little story, Goddamn it, is in two papers on the front page. Right.” (Ibid., Kissinger Telephone Conversations, Box 9, Chronological File)↩
- The headline on a front page story in The New York Times proclaimed “A New Incursion in Laos Possible, Abrams Indicates.” The Washington Post ran a front-page story entitled “Viet Push Into Laos Indicated,” that reads in part, “Gen. Creighton Abrams, the U.S. Commander in Vietnam, said today a fresh South Vietnamese drive is under way in the Ashau Valley that could involve renewed attacks in Laos.”↩
- When Nixon made this point to Kissinger in their earlier telephone conversation, the President said, “He just got sucked into it. Some God-damned newspaper guy wanted to get a story to the effect we were going back in Laos, because the news guys out there are dying. He just feels so compelled to be so God-damned honest all the time. Why doesn’t he just shut up.” (National Archives, Nixon Presidential Materials, Kissinger Telephone Conversations, Box 9, Chronological File)↩
- Brackets are in the original.↩