Office of the Historian

130. Memorandum of Conversation0

Washington, December 4, 1963, 11 a.m.

SUBJECT

  • Cambodia

PARTICIPANTS

  • U.S.
    • The Secretary
    • Assistant Secretary for European Affairs William R. Tyler
    • Frazier Meade, EUR/BNA
  • UK
    • British Ambassador Sir David Ormsby Gore

The Secretary raised the subject of Cambodia and gave a brief summary of Sihanouk’s actions towards the United States and its aid program. Sir David asked what the United States attitude would be towards Sihanouk’s requests for a conference. Would the United States let Sihanouk stew? The Secretary said it was important to make clear to Sihanouk that there could be no conference if it was merely to exchange polemics. We were inclined to accept the French suggestion to hold an experts’ meeting on the conference and we planned to get someone over quickly. Procedurally, we ought first to decide what should be the results of the conference, we should then negotiate these aims with the participants prior to the conference and then we should let the conference meet to ratify these goals. We would not agree to a conference if we could not get prior agreement on the desired results.1

Sir David said he thought his government would prefer the conference be attended by the full 14 participants rather than a smaller-sized conference of 9. The Secretary said a larger conference would drag the Thais in. He thought we could go a long way to meet Thailand’s doubts without involving them in the conference.

Concerning the level of the Cambodia Conference, the Secretary said he would oppose a foreign ministers’ meeting. Sir David said the [Page 279] British would oppose a conference being held in Indonesia. When the Secretary suggested Geneva, Sir David said he thought it would be necessary to agree on an Asian site in view of Cambodia’s requests.

  1. Source: Department of State, Central Files, POL 7 CAMB. Confidential. Drafted by Frazier Meade of EUR/BNA and approved in S on December 9. The meeting was held in the Secretary’s office. The source text is labeled “Part 1 of 6.”↩

  2. In a December 6 memorandum to Bundy, Clifford Alexander commented on a summary of this meeting:

    “The momentum over at State to go along with a conference is rapidly getting beyond redemption. In our race to the conference table no one to my knowledge has given one sound benefit which we might derive from such a gathering.

    “The Secretary told the British Ambassador yesterday that we were inclined to agree to a conference ‘provided reasonable results could be obtained.’ Certainly we should not commit ourselves to anyone else before Mike gets back and gives us a first-hand report of just how upset our friends will be if we take this seemingly pointless step.” (Johnson Library, National Security File, Country File, Cambodia, Vol. I)

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