63. Transcript of a Telephone Conversation Between the President’s Assistant for National Security Affairs (Kissinger) and the Soviet Ambassador (Dobrynin)1
D: I just arrived from New York.
K: Did you have a good time?
D: Not exactly—it was a very short visit.
K: You called me yesterday.
D: Yes because yesterday I was in New York and Vorontsov was with Mr. Davies at State.2
K: Who?
D: Mr. Davies, Deputy Assistant Secretary dealing with East European affairs. He works for Mr. Hillenbrand.
K: Oh yes, I know who.
D: And he invited Vorontsov yesterday and he mentioned two points. The second, about the gentleman, you know.3
K: Yes, but he doesn’t know anything about it. The Secretary will talk to you about that next week.
D: He put some conditions on it and Moscow will be very angry.
K: There will be no conditions.
D: He already said it.
K: What are they?
D: That we have to give back Mr. [Kudirka] who is a Soviet citizen, an unbelievable demand, and second about the four Americans in East Germany.4 I told Vorontsov to hold this until I came back to Washington to discuss it with you.
K: Let me discuss it with the President. Don’t make this an official thing.
D: Should I drop it with you?
K: Let me talk to the President to make sure.
D: I asked him to hold it because I knew he would send a telegram to Moscow. He put it down in writing.
[Page 202]K: What I communicated to you was the expression of the President with no conditions attached. The only thing I want to confirm—which I already know the answer to—is that this was not a change made without my knowing it. Let me call you tomorrow morning.
D: I will hold it till tomorrow morning.
K: Could you?
D: Yes. I was so surprised with these changes of mind.
K: There is no change.