Office of the Historian

95. Transcript of Telephone Conversation Between the President’s Assistant for National Security Affairs (Kissinger) and Secretary of Defense Schlesinger1

Washington, July 30, 1973, 9:30 p.m.

K: Hello.

S: Hello, Henry.

K: Jim two things. I have a backchannel from Graham Martin2 who was in Phnom Penh and who feels we should switch bombing to the frontier and concentrations along the frontier.

[Page 387]

S: OK, you mean the B–52s?

K: Yes. He also claims there are restrictions on our bombing.

S: I know not about that. The Embassy had restrictions on bombing in the south.

K: For what reason?

S: I never figured that one out. I think we discussed it with you in San Clemente.

K: And I overruled it then.

S: I think so. Well, I’ll check on it. I assumed it was called off but they may still be using it in the field.

K: Can we make sure. There are only two weeks left.

S: ______

K: In the next two weeks and fast.

S: You’re sure you want that. There has been a proclivity to lay low in the frontier. Any way let me look into it.

K: I know I want it. What is the proclivity?

S: I think the attitude may have been that the purpose was to show up the Cambodian bombings not to beat the hell out of the ______ of South Vietnam.

K: But South Vietnam is the ballgame.

S: Yes, but we have got some kind of ceasefire with these bastards. Suddenly we open up with B–52s. Let me look at this problem and get back to you shortly.

K: But today.

S: Yes.

K: Jim, about our Friday conversation, could you let me know as soon as possible what you are doing so we can get word to ______ and also if there is any information. We got to prepare ourselves properly.

S: OK. Very good. I will go to John Foster.

K: Can you let me know by the end of the day tomorrow?

S: That is going to be hard on the first question because we don’t know what we are going to do on the sanctuaries.

K: You don’t have to give an answer on what we are going to do; what I want to know is what ______ and what procedures we are ginning up to get ourselves ready. We would like to give a positive response and attitude.

S: OK.

  1. Source: National Archives, Nixon Presidential Materials, Henry A. Kissinger Telephone Conversation Transcripts, Box 21, Chronological File. No classification marking. Blank underscores are omissions in the original.↩
  2. Backchannel message 534 from Saigon, July 30; ibid., NSC Files, Box 416, Backchannel Messages, Martin, July 19–December 1973.↩