63. Telephone Conversation Between President Johnson and Secretary of State Rusk1
LBJ: Hello? Dean?
DR: Yes sir.
LBJ: I donʼt want any other human to know this—Iʼve talked to you and Bob [McNamara]—but I fairly think I would like to go out to Honolulu on Saturday night2 with you and Bob and meet Westmoreland, who is there now, and have Sharp give me a briefing on U.S. military matters on Monday and probably ask for Lodge to come up and, if he can, bring Ky and Thieu with him, the Chief of State, and talk to them about some of the non-military matters, pacification, and have with me, probably, Freeman and Keppel and the Surgeon General of Health, to kind of, as a cover and discussion on—weʼve been thinking of sending these educational, agricultural, and health missions out there. And I think it would give me a chance to visit with Westmoreland and get a little bit closer to his problems and what he envisages out there. And certainly let them see me and [Page 204] let Sharp see me. And I think at the same time, if I had the proper political diplomatic group with me, I could talk to them about what we could do to increase our pacification efforts and our economic aid thatʼs pending and so on and so forth. I rather think, too, that in the briefings that will follow that it would be good to have just visited with Westmoreland some. Now heʼs gonna be there for two or three or four days. I know of nothing urgent thatʼs keeping me here Saturday night. We could leave Saturday night and be there—leave here Saturday evening—be there at midnight and then stay over ʼtil about Tuesday and come on back. I want you to give it a little thought. Unless you have very violent objections, I would like you to send Lodge a cable without a bunch of secretaries over there knowing it, because I donʼt want anybody to know it. Just the most secret thing that we can have in the State Department, if we can have anything secret. And ask him if he could meet us there. I would be there Sunday on, if he could come up Monday. And for him to ascertain if he could bring these other two fellows with him. I rather think it might help this fellow in his own country and I think weʼd have a little insurance having Thieu, their Chief of State, so if something happened to Ky, well we wouldnʼt necessarily be tied to Ky too much. And I would like for us to be in a little contact with whatʼs happening as well as Mansfield.
DR: Are you alone in your office here?
LBJ: No, Iʼm alone in my bedroom.
DR: Oh, I see. May I have a word with you about this after our briefing session.3
LBJ: Sure. Sure you can any way. I just want to be sure we get a cable out to Lodge asking him if he can go.
DR: Well, Iʼm here at the White House now so I can do this when I get back to the office.
- Source: Johnson Library, Recordings and Transcripts, Recording of Telephone Conversation between Johnson and Rusk, Tape F66.04, Side A, PNO 3. No classification marking. This transcript was prepared by the Office of the Historian specifically for this volume.↩
- February 5.↩
- The President and Rusk met with the Congressional leadership at 6:17 p.m. for a briefing on the Indian food situation. Rusk did not meet afterward with the President but did speak with him by telephone at 8:06 p.m. The conversation was not recorded. (Johnson Library, Presidentʼs Daily Diary)↩