Paris Peace Conf. 180.03501/65
HD–65
Notes of a Meeting of the Heads of Delegations of the Five Great Powers Held in M. Pichon’s Room at the Quai d’Orsay, Paris, on Thursday, October 2, 1919, at 10:30 a.m.
-
Present
-
America, United States of
- Hon. F. L. Polk.
-
Secretary
- Mr. L. Harrison.
-
British Empire
- Sir Eyre Crowe.
-
Secretary
- Mr. H. Norman.
-
France
- M. Clemenceau.
- M. Pichon.
-
Secretaries
- M. Dutasta.
- M. Berthelot.
- M. de St. Quentin.
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Italy
- M. Scialoja.
-
Secretary
- M. Barone Russo.
-
Japan
- M. Matsui.
-
Secretary
- M. Kawai.
-
America, United States of
Joint Secretariat | |
America, United States of | Captain Chapin |
British Empire | Captain Hinchley-Cooke |
France | M. Massigli |
Italy | M. Zanchi. |
Interpreter—M. Camerlynck |
The following were also present for the items in which they were concerned.
-
America, United States of
- Colonel Logan.
-
British Empire
- Lt. Col. Kisch.
- Major Money
- Mr. Ibbetson-James
-
France
- General Weygand
- M. Tirman
- M. Max Lazard
- M. Seydoux
-
Italy
- Maggiore Rugiu.
1. (The Council had before it a letter from the Legation of the Netherlands dated August 9th, (Appendix “A”) together with a note from the Ports, Waterways and Railways Commission, dated August 20th (Appendix “B”).) Negotiations With Holland Regarding Article 354 of the German Peace Treaty, Relative to Modification of the Convention of Mannheim
M. Titran, in explanation of the matter in question, Reiative said that Article 354 of the German Peace Treaty up-held the Convention of Mannheim of 1868,1 with certain modifications. The first of these dealt with the [Page 484] composition of a Commission charged with supervising the control of the traffic on the Rhine, and the second with technical matters regarding the navigation. Following the Treaty of Frankfort in 18712 the Convention of Mannheim had remained in force but the French representative on the Commission had been replaced by a delegate from Alsace-Lorraine. It was clear that in order to modify the Convention at the present time Holland should consent thereto, as it was a signatory power. The question before the Council was to determine in what manner the Government of the Netherlands should be invited to participate in the negotiations for a further modification of the Convention of Mannheim. He felt that the Council itself was the proper body to address the invitation in question.
Mr. Polk said that he was not familiar with the details of the question but that he believed it to be one which interested France and the British Empire especially. He therefore suggested that it would be well to convoke a Commission composed of representatives of these two countries to consider the question.
M. Tirman replied that it was a question of execution of a clause of the German Peace Treaty and that the Council itself, which was the proper body to supervise such execution, should issue the invitation to the Dutch Government.
Mr. Polk asked what procedure M. Tirman suggested in the matter.
M. Tirman said that the President of the Council might address a formal invitation to the Government of the Netherlands.
Sir Eyre Crowe remarked that there were two phases of the matter. In the first place, it was necessary to obtain the agreement of the Dutch Government to a further modification of the Mannheim Convention. In the second place, the question might arise of the eventual participation of the Netherlands in the General Convention provided for by Article 338 of the German Peace Treaty, regarding the rivers which were to be internationalized.
M. Tirman agreed that two questions were involved. In the first place there was a necessity of executing a clause of the German Peace Treaty at once. On the other hand, Article 354 gave a temporary character to the organization set up in the Peace Treaty. A general Convention was provided for for the international rivers, and the Treaty further stipulated that if the general Convention should not agree with the Convention for the Rhine the latter should be modified. It was known that the Netherlands were desirous of taking part in the General Convention, and it appeared that the Treaty gave them all the guarantees in this matter which they might wish.
At all events, the Treaty provided that the General Convention should not become absolute until it had been approved by the League of [Page 485] Nations. Holland had already asked to be admitted to the League of Nations. Furthermore, the Treaty provided that if a General Convention were not agreed upon, the Central Commission of the Ehine (in which The Netherlands were represented) would be charged with drawing up a definite convention for that river. In any case, the Dutch Government would receive satisfaction.
Sir Eyre Crowe asked to what Conference the Dutch Government was to be invited, whether it was to be one between the Principal Allied and Associated Powers, or a meeting of the delegates of the Governments composing the Central Rhine Commission. If the invitation was to a Conference of the Principal Allied and Associated Powers the United States of America would be represented therein, while Switzerland, a state vitally interested in the question, would not. On the second hypothesis, the United States would not be represented while Switzerland would be.
M. Tirman said that he believed the conference should be between representatives of all the Powers who were to be members of the Central Rhine Commission, but that the meeting should take place under the auspices of the Council in order not to exclude the Great Powers which were not represented on the former body. The conference should take place in two phases. The Dutch Government should first be invited to agree to the modification of the Convention of Mannheim, of which it was a part. One of the modifications would be the admission of Switzerland, which was not at the present time a party to the Convention. Thereafter the Swiss Government should be invited to participate in the remainder of the negotiations.
(It was decided:
- (1)
- that the President of the Peace Conference should invite The Netherlands Government to take part in the negotiations provided for by Article 354 of the Peace Treaty with Germany, relative to the modification of the Convention of Mannheim of 1868;
- (2)
- that the negotiations in question should take place under the auspices of the Supreme Council, between the interested Allied Powers (who are represented on the Central Rhine Commission, in accordance with Article 355 of the German Peace Treaty), and The Netherlands Government;
- (3)
- that the Swiss Government should later be invited to take part in the negotiations.
2. (The Council had before it a note from Marshal Foch dated September 29th, 1919, (See Appendix “C”.).)
General Weygand in explanation of the note in question said that the Polish Authorities had addressed a request for supplies to Marshal Foch in his capacity of Commander-in-Chief of the Polish Forces. This request appeared to Marshal Foch in all respects worthy of satisfaction, for according to the statements of General Henrys and other officers of the [Page 486] Inter-Allied Staff who had been in Poland the Polish Army was in great need of the supplies asked for. With the exception of General Haller’s troops, the army was insufficiently equipped. For example, in one regiment there were only two overcoats per company. A continuation of this state of affairs, in view of the approaching winter, would lead to an exceedingly critical situation from the point of view of the morale of the Polish Army and might cause a retreat of this force from the line of the Beresina. Marshal Foch, believing that it was to the interest of the Allies to maintain the Polish Army intact, wished to support the request which had been formulated. In the letter to the Council he had included only such requests as he believed to be of prime importance and which should be granted at once if the situation were to be saved. Note From Marshal Foch Supporting a Request for Military Supplies From the Polish Government
M. Clemenceau asked how it was planned to transport this material to Poland, assuming that it was available.
General Weygand said that the Allied Headquarters had already studied this problem. The transportation question was indeed a difficult one. The Port of Danzig was only available for the supply of food for the civilian population. Germany, of course, would not be prepared to permit supplies for the Polish Army to cross its frontiers. It had, therefore, been necessary to search out other routes. At the present time one regular train was running daily to Poland via Italy, which might be made use of. In addition the Italian Government was prepared to permit four trains per week to pass by way of the Brenner. Furthermore by using the route through Switzerland, Austria and Czecho-Slovakia it was possible to obtain two trains per day. For the latter transport, however, Austria and Czecho-Slovakia had asked that France should guarantee the expenses and furnish the coal. It was impossible for France to do this alone and it would consequently be necessary to add this charge, in addition to the expenses for the supply of material, to the account of the Principal Allied and Associated Powers. The total transport under this scheme would be twenty-five trains per week or about one hundred monthly. He had figured that the 600,000 uniforms requested would take approximately ninety-five trains or, in other words, that the shipment of these could be completed in somewhat less than a month’s time.
Mr. Scialoja asked whether the four trains proceeding by the Brenner route would interfere with the shipments of material which were now being made to Poland under contract between that country and Italy. Should the arrangements as outlined by General Weygand be put into effect he would like to have it understood that they should not prejudice the shipments which Italy was now making.
General Weygand said that there would be no difficulty in continuing the shipments referred to by Mr. Scialoja, and that the four trains which he had mentioned would be in addition to those shipments. [Page 487] It was first necessary that Marshal Foch’s Staff should agree with the Headquarters of the other Allied Armies as to what material could be shipped to Poland. Unquestionably this material would not all be concentrated at one point. He was anxious to obtain the authorization of the Council to consult the other Allied Headquarters in this matter.
Sir Eyre Crowe said that he had not yet been able to take this question up with his Government. He believed that the best method of procedure would be to instruct the Council of Military Experts at Versailles to study the question. This body had already formulated a general scheme for the supply of material to troops fighting the Bolshevists, and it was therefore probable that they could quickly arrive at a solution in the matter. In the meantime he would consult his Government.
General Weygand said that he feared much time would be lost by referring the matter to Military Experts at Versailles.
M. Clemenceau said that the difficulty might be overcome by instructing the Versailles Council to act without delay.
Mr. Polk said that the question from his point of view was largely a financial one. He agreed in the main with General Weygand’s remarks.
M. Clemenceau said that during such time as Mr. Polk and Sir Eyre Crowe were discussing the matter with their Governments the Military Experts at Versailles could be studying the practical means of executing the matter. The Polish Army was of great importance to the Allies as it constituted one of the best means of coercing Germany. It was very necessary to maintain this army in the field owing to the fact that Great Britain, the United States and France had so largely demobilized their troops.
General Weygand said that the Council at Versailles should be instructed to turn over the matter to Marshal Foch’s Headquarters for execution. He would collaborate with General Belin throughout the examination of the question.
It was decided:
to refer the request for material received from the Polish Ministry of War and approved by Marshal Foch, to the Allied Military Experts at Versailles and to instruct the latter to make an examination of the question with the least possible delay and report thereon to the Council.
It was further decided:
that the carrying out of the recommendations of the Allied Military Experts, if and when approved by the Supreme Council, should be entrusted to the Headquarters of Marshal Foch.
3. Sir Eyre Crowe said that as it had already been decided that the Commission for the repatriation of German, Austrian and Hungarian prisoners of war from Siberia should function in Paris and not in Siberia, the only question before the Council was that of nominations for this Commission. After a short discussion, Designation of Members of the Commission for the Repatriation of German, Austrian and Hungarian Prisoners of War From Serbia [Siberia]
It was decided:
that the Commission for the repatriation of German, Austrian and Hungarian prisoners of war from Siberia should be composed as follows:
-
America, United States
of:
Colonel James A. Logan. -
British Empire:
Lt.-Colonel Black. -
France:
Lt.-Commander Fabre. -
Italy:
(Not yet designated.) -
Japan:
Major Katsuki.
It was further decided:
that the said Commission should function in Paris.
4. (The Council had before it a note from General Weygand relative to the repatriation of Czecho-Slovak, Polish, Jugoslav and Rumanian troops in Siberia (Appendix “D”).)
M. Clemenceau said that the note in question suggested a modification of the second paragraph of the resolution passed by the Council on September 27th in this matter. (The paragraph in question, (H. D. 62, Minute 7) read as follows: Repatriation of Polish, Jugoslav and Rumanian Troops From Siberia
“It was also decided: that the repatriation of the Czecho-Slovak troops in Siberia should be effected before that of the German, Austrian and Hungarian prisoners in Siberia.”)
As there were a considerable number of the troops of other Allied Nations in Siberia in addition to the Czecho-Slovak forces, it was proposed to substitute the following paragraph for that quoted above:
“It was also decided that the repatriation of the Czecho-Slovak, Polish, Jugoslav and Rumanian troops in Siberia should be effected before that of the German, Austrian and Hungarian prisoners.”
He was of the opinion that this procedure should be adopted.
Mr. Polk said that he had just received word from Washington [Page 489] that the German Government had been negotiating for the repatriation of its prisoners of war from Siberia, and had arranged with a Japanese steamship company for the chartering of six vessels for this purpose.
M. Berthelot suggested that M. Matsui ascertain the truth of this information, and if the facts were exact, the six vessels in question should be turned over for the use of the Allied Governments.
M. Matsui said that he had no information on the subject but that the repatriation of German prisoners in the hands of the Japanese was going on, and the negotiations referred to by Mr. Polk might conceivably be for this matter.
(It was decided:
to modify the second paragraph of the resolution taken by the Council on September 27th, (H. D. 62, Minute 7) so that the same should read as follows:
“It was also decided: that the repatriation of the Czecho-Slovak, Polish, Jugoslav and Rumanian troops in Siberia should be effected before that of the German, Austrian and Hungarian prisoners.”)
5. (The Council had before it a proposal submitted by the British Delegation, dated September 30th, 1919, asking that the Russian Battleship Volya be transferred to General Denekin Proposal To (Appendix “E”).)
Sir Eyre Crowe said that this matter had been brought up before the Council on account of the fact that the Russian Battleship involved had been turned over to the Allied and Associated Powers under Article 29 of the Armistice of November 11th, 1918. The consent of the Council to its transfer to General Denekin was therefore necessary. Proposal To Deliver the Russian Battleship “Volya” to General Uenekin
M. Clemenceau said that he personally had no objection to this transfer taking place.
Mr. Polk said that he personally had no objection to formulate, but that he would consult the American Naval experts and notify the Secretary-General of his decision in the matter later in the day.
(Mr. Polk later stated that the American Delegation had no objection to the procedure proposed.)
(It was decided:
that the Russian Battleship Volya, handed over to the Allied and Associated Powers under Article 29 of the Armistice of November 11th, 1918, should be transferred by the British Admiralty to General Denekin.)
6. (The Council had before it a note from the Secretary-General of the International Labor Commission, relative to applications [Page 490] made by Finland, Norway and The Netherlands for admission to the Labor Congress at Washington (Appendix “F”).)
Mr. Polk said that the matters raised by the note in question should be left to the Labor Congress for decision. Applications From Finland, Norway and the Netherlands for Admission to the Labor Congress at Washington
M. Clemenceau agreed with Mr. Polk and asked merely that the United States Government should permit the representatives of the countries in question to go to the United States, by issuing them the necessary passports.
Mr. Polk said that he would have the same letter addressed to the representatives of Finland, Norway and The Netherlands as had been sent to the German and Austrian Labor Delegates (See H. D. 52, Minute 4;3 and H. D. 56, Minute 1.)4
(It was decided:
that the questions raised by the note of the Secretary-General of the International Labor Commission relative to the admission of delegates from Finland, Norway and The Netherlands to the forthcoming Labor Congress at Washington, should be left to the decision of that Congress.
It was further decided:
that the American Delegation should notify the Secretary-General of the International Labor Commission that no obstacles would be placed in the way of Finnish, Norwegian or Dutch delegates desirous of proceeding to Washington in anticipation of a decision in their favor by the Congress.)
7. Sir Eyre Crowe said that there were two possible ways by which the Neutral Governments might be informed of the decision of the Council regarding the Blockade of Soviet Russia. First, a joint notification might be made in each of the neutral capitals by the diplomatic representatives of the Principal Allied and Associated Powers. Secondly, a note might be sent by M. Clemenceau, as President of the Peace Conference, to the Diplomatic Representatives of the Neutral countries in Paris. Procedure To Be Followed in Notifying Neutral Governments Regarding the Blockade of Soviet Russia
Mr. Polk said that the second solution proposed by Sir Eyre Crowe seemed to him to be the more practical one.
(After a short discussion, it was decided:
that M. Clemenceau, as President of the Peace Conference, should address a note to the Diplomatic Representatives of the Neutral Powers at Paris informing them of the decision of the Council regarding economic pressure to be exercised upon Soviet Russia.)
8. (The Council had before it a note from the Austrian Delegation dated September 17th, regarding the disturbances that had occurred in the Comitats of Western Hungary (Appendix “G”).)
M. Berthelot said that the Austrian Government asked that Allied Officers be sent to Western Hungary to protect the population from the disturbances which were occurring there at the present time. They further asked that an Interallied Commission might be sent to Oedenburg to prevent a repetition of the acts of violence which had occurred there, and to supervise the conduct of the Hungarian troops at the time of the evacuation of the territory in question. Note From the Austrian Government Regarding the Situation in the Comitats of Western Hungary
Sir Eyre Crowe said that it was a question of enforcing certain terms of the Austrian Treaty.
M. Berthelot suggested that officers might be detached for this duty from the Allied Military Missions at Vienna.
M. Scialoja said that there were still Hungarian troops in this territory because the new boundary between Austria and Hungary had not yet been officially notified to the Hungarian Government.
M. Pichon admitted that this was the case, and stated that the reason therefor was that no recognized Government had as yet been set up in Hungary.
Mr. Polk suggested that the Allied Generals in Budapest should be informed officially as to the frontier between Austria and Hungary and should be instructed to convey this information to the Hungarian authorities.
(It was decided:
- (1)
- that an Interallied Military Commission, composed of officers to be drawn from the Allied Military Representatives at Vienna or Budapest, should be sent to the Comitats of Western Hungary to assist in the maintenance of order in the territories granted to Austria by the Treaty of Saint Germain;
- (2)
- that this Mission should be under the orders of the Allied General Officers at Budapest;
- (3)
- that the Allied Generals at Budapest should be officially informed of the frontier between Austria and Hungary, as defined in the Peace Treaty of Saint Germain.)
(The Meeting then adjourned.)
Hotel de Crillon, Paris, October 2, 1919.
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